Mylar 7.5mil, eat blades?

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This topic contains 11 replies, has 2 voices, and was last updated by  Sandy 1 hour, 29 minutes ago.

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  • #24239

    Ashly Mellor
    Participant

    Hi All,

    Did my homework and ordered a force a bit ago, first machine we receive was DOA and we just receive our replacement. Excellent customer service.

    We were super excited to get it up and running as we tried for weeks to get the first on to work. Every thing was going well, followed the suggested cutting guide for .0075 mylar with the Red blade and it went only about half way through the mylar, so we followed the directions on setting everything up just a tad and still nothing. So we put our X-ray material in, cut well. Okay, making progress.

    Got the blue blade out, still not hardly a dent. Upped settings up to 10mil, still not a cut through. But Xray material back on, which we knew cut now will not cut, both blades were toast from a hand full of attempts on the mylar. Seems insane to me that a few attempts following all directions to the “T” killed the blades that fast. I am sure it is 7.5mil mylar. I buy it wholesale from a company in China that supplies a very large re-seller in the US. I can get this mylar to cut on my Cricut, with a lot of work of course and why I bought this machine, so it seems a little crazy for it to eat blades on this muscle machine.

    Any advice? Can you send samples in to KNK for them to try to cut items?

    Just bummer of course, I finally got a working machine and now have to wait on blades, I just have to laugh at this point. All part of the learning curve. I am hoping this will all be worth it!

     

    Thanks all!

    #24289

    Sandy
    Moderator

    Is the Mylar stuck down well onto the mat?  Did you brayer it down?  If there are any spots where the material isn’t stabilized by the adhesive on the mat, those spots won’t cut.

    Also, the springs can vary a bit from one blade holder to the next, so you probably just need to increase the CD/ED until you get a clean cut.  The settings in the table reflect just one tester’s experience and are meant to be a guideline for the test cut, not necessarily the setting that every user will find to be optimal.

    Since writing the last update in the manual, I’ve learned from Ron at KNK USA, that using a very narrow wide rectangle makes for the best test cut shape to insure that the settings will work across the width of the material. He personally tends to leave the BT at the recommended setting (or even lower) and then adjusts Passes and CD/ED until he gets a perfect clean cut of that rectangle.  If you will be cutting smaller more intricate shapes, you might want to use a narrow row of small shapes as your test… such as a row of small letters.

    Also, I recommend keeping the Plunge Speed at 20 and no higher. I believe that if a high PS is used, in combination with a high CD/ED, then the tip of the blade can be damaged when it hits the material.  The blades can still be usual in most cases, but an even higher CD/ED will be needed.

    Hope this helps!

    #24292

    Ashly Mellor
    Participant

    Thank you for your reply Sandy!

    It was very stuck to the mat, so we know that was not the problem. 🙂

    The blades are completely toast, will not even cut paper at this point, that is why I am so shocked. We tried both blade housings that came with the machine, but again we had a bad machine shipped the first time and these housings are from the first machine, any chance they are bad too? Seems like that would be quite odd.

    We were cutting squares, as that is how I always tested materials on my Cricut too.

    Thank you for all the suggestions. As soon as my new blades arrive I will try them and see if we can get this crazy stuff to cut! I might order some of KNK’s mylar to compare and see if there is a vast difference between the two.

     

    Thank you I can’t wait to get this machine up and running for good, I want to kick my Cricuts off the roof 😉

    #24410

    Sandy
    Moderator

    Okay. Let us know how it goes!

    #24655

    Ashly Mellor
    Participant

    Okay so we finally got it to cut through the material. Ya!

    The problem seems to be the mat shift. The mat shifts so bad during cuts that the blade hits the metal bar and then kills the blade, really frustrating. As we see the shift happening we try to cancel the cut but it takes to long to send the signal to the machine and bam, dead blade.

    So here I am, ordering another part (Force Mat Guide), something that should come with these machines, and I have a machine that is not usable. Going on 6 weeks of ownership and zero profitability.

    Just a thought for the future, the Force is not usable without the mat guides, so it seems, so including them and raising the cost of the machine by $5.99 would save a lot of frustration for the end user.

    Hope to have a machine that will be producing products, as intended, before month 3!

    #24843

    Sandy
    Moderator

    The mat guides are a convenience, not a necessity. Most owners don’t use them at all.  I use one on the right side because I like being able to align my mat in a certain location. But I never use the left side one. Also, when doing a PNC, I don’t use either because I don’t want the added friction on the mat as it travels in and out of the cutter.

    Regarding the mat shifting… three things to check:

    (1) You should be using the two outside pinch rollers in the two outside locations. In other words don’t rely on, say, the right one and the middle one or the middle one and the left one.

    (2)  Those two outside pinch rollers must be centered with the grit shafts below. Now the dark gray vinyl rectangles should guide you to where to slide those pinch wheels, but it’s a good idea to verify, with the mat not inside the Force, that those rectangles were adhered in the correct spots on the Force.  In other words, having the two pinch wheels directly over the grit shafts is extremely important in keeping the mat from skewing.

    (3) Make sure your cut settings aren’t causing the skewing.  If the blade is being forced through the material too deeply and/or too quickly, then the mat may be forced out of position.  In that case, first try a lower speed. But it may also make sense to lower the ED and use more passes.

    Post back if you still have issues or start a support ticket at knkusa.com.

    #24844

    Ashly Mellor
    Participant

    Thank you Sandy!

    The guides just arrived today so we are going to give them a shot. We are running out of options.

    The 3 pinch rollers were all placed exactly how you are explaining and we were ending up with a good 15-20 degree shift, which is huge.

    We noticed the lower the speed the worse the shift got. We also had the settings to the lowest settings we could go to achieve the cut, again back to the original problem, we couldn’t get this mylar to cut.

    Here are the settings:

    P (3) SD (90) ED (90) S (15) UP(25) PS(40) LS(40)

     

    Thank you!

    #24883

    Sandy
    Moderator

    Your SD should always start out lower so that the blade can work its way through the material. If it’s the same as the ED, then you’re forcing the blade to a depth that it may not be able to reach in the first pass and something  has to give… that being the cutting mat.

    #25110

    Ashly Mellor
    Participant

    Thank you for all your help Sandy!

    We have made adjustments and have the guides installed and the SD lowered to 65 (lowest we can go and still get a through cut) and the speed upped a bit to 20. We get clean cuts on small things but anything larger, and by large I am not talking even that big, 2″ letters is where we start having problems, we are still experiencing a shift, where the 2nd pass is cutting substantially off. Please see images… any ideas?

    We are officially out of ideas and have not a single clean cut.

    Thank you for your ongoing help, it is very appreciated!
    We are really wanting to love this machine, we hope soon that we will.

     

    IMG_3161

    IMG_3156

    #25147

    Sandy
    Moderator

    That mat will shift any time the blade is being forced too deep and/or too quickly than it cut the material.  OR if the two outside pinch wheels are not centered over the grit shafts beneath the mat (check that first).

    So, you may need to drop the CS to 15 instead of 20.   Also,  lower the SD still and increase the ED.  If the blade is struggling at 65 and causing the mat to skew, then allow it to cut with less aggression.  So, perhaps, SD = 35 and ED = 100 will do the trick in 3 passes.

    #25174

    Ashly Mellor
    Participant

    Thank you Sandy!

    We made those adjustments, and we are still experiencing the same exact problem except now we are adding in not all letters are being cut fully through.

    I think we will keep decreasing the SD and increasing the ED and see if we get anywhere, but we are at taking over 30 minutes to cut a sheet and this isn’t going to work time management wise… I must be missing something.

     

    #25180

    Sandy
    Moderator

    I’m now wondering if using a PS of 40 when you switch blades if the tip of the blade might be damaged if you aren’t backing way off on the depth settings you just tested.    But I’m going to have Ron at KNKUSA look over this thread and see what suggestions he has. I must be missing something.  Sorry this has been such a difficult application… it shouldn’t be since the Mylar is only 7.5 mil.

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